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Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:12:21

Count Grishnackh
Level 16
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It has come to my attention that the ban system on WarLight is broken. The system should be reformed to optimize player experience.

-Separate bans
There should be a separate ban from the game and on the forums. The whole point of a ban is to stop someone from doing whatever they were doing, because it was harmful. That harm might have been delivered on the forums, but not on the game, or vice versa. There's no point in banning someone from the whole game when harmful activity was isolated to one medium. This would increase activity, as someone who was banned on the forum would still be playing the game.

-Ban appeals
There are countless instances when bans were unfair. There should be a ban appeals section on the forums where one can petition a ban to be revoked or reduced. Nothing should be final, opinions change, new evidence comes in. Ban reasons are subjective anyway.

-Clearly defining rule-violating behavior
"Spamming the chat" is not against the rules according to the rules, but you can be banned for it. WTF? "Disrespect" is too broad and can be applied to almost anything. Players should be able to express some heavy emotions and criticism, too often this falls under the banner of "disrespect." Rules need to be better defined. Also, bans should spell out which rule was violated instead of quoting things you said.

-Eliminating favoritism
This goes without saying, if every player is going to enjoy the site then players should stop being singled out for personal and political differences in bans. A close-knit group of players who are friends with the admins and don't get banned for ban-worthy behavior are toxic to the community. This tells players who think differently or aren't friends with those guys that they don't matter, and the rules become nothing. If only some players have to follow the rules then the rules are pretty much meaningless.
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:22:32

Fizzer 
Level 57

WarLight Creator
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Here's a subset of the things you've said on WarLight in the past week:

"we all know you're a fat little shit eating cunt fagboy"
"you're a fucking faggot"
"David is probably an edgy little fat faggot kid with a 3 inch dick"

This is what qualifies as treating other player's with disrespect as well as using highly offensive language. One of the goals of the warning, suspension, and ban system is to get rid of this kind of behavior. Given that you're one of the perpetrators of it, asking for a reduction in penalties just makes me want to increase the penalties further.
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:24:18


Richard Sharpe 
Level 59
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Increase them further. No question about that.

If anything, they are far too lenient! Though given the ease of making new accounts I can understand limiting them.

Edited 6/5/2016 20:25:03
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:25:14

Count Grishnackh
Level 16
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@ Fizzer

Irrelevant. I never asked to petition that particular ban, that was just me having some fun.

This post covers all bans in general. Fizzer himself uses ad hominem fallacies?

I'm no saint but the things I've outlined here are valid, my character doesn't invalidate them.

Edited 6/5/2016 20:25:49
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:27:40


GeneralPE
Level 56
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You deserve a suspension for the stuff Fizzer posted, but idk why they were relevant. I see no issue with the reforms you put forth. They would help in the case of something like Willy's bullcrap suspension.
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:28:02


Genghis 
Level 52
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Can we report fizzer for that?
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:28:47


Genghis 
Level 52
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I don't this guy really deserves a suspension. I don't think insults are hurting anybody but his own reputation.
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:28:54


GeneralPE
Level 56
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Yeah he did post some pretty harsh language there
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:30:06

Count Grishnackh
Level 16
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You're derailing.
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:37:51


[Wolf] Relmcheatham
Level 56
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@Prussian


Why can't there be separate bans? You didn't even refute his arguments you just did a character attack.


"Fizzer why are you so mad though?"
^ You said this right before you complained about him attacking someone's character, therefor an oxymoron.

Not addressing something is neither confirming or denying it. Assuming something is wrong or right based on someone not refuting it is even worse.


+1 Fizzer

Edited 6/5/2016 20:44:51
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:41:10

platypus
Level 54
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Prussian Monarchist, Smug Wojak. talking about age: Yesterday in the diplo, you completely saturated chat and made it unusable with your idiotic spamming of it. we didn´t even start the game by Castle bravo because of you. Don´t do it again. Too bad we didn´t start the game so everyone here could see what you were writing. Comeone man, don´t waste anyone´s time anymore.
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:41:20


Genghis 
Level 52
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I like these 2 new threads. They've really brought up an important issue. Never even noticed this before.

Oh wait
https://www.warlight.net/Forum/152918-timetoendthecuckolds-wherestheequaltreatment

COME UP WITH ORIGINAL THREAD IDEAS, JEEZ...
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 20:56:36


[Wolf] Relmcheatham
Level 56
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@Prussian


Somebody can not be wrong for not addressing an issue and whether Fizzer did it intentionally or not for that purpose 1. matters little, and 2. is irrelevant to whether the issue is right or wrong.
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 21:21:47


TBest 
Level 59
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-Separate bans
Yes, I would like to see this, with mod being able to impose the 'lesser' bans. However. this must be coded, and is only one among many other things WL could benefit from. Place it on the not-so-immediate road-map somewhere.

-Ban appeals
They exists. To appeal a ban, contact Fizzer.

-Clearly defining rule-violating behavior
In practice, this would massively increase the number of bans. For example, if two or more "bad" words gives a warning. And 3 warnings a ban, plenty of players would be banned. Basically the subjectivity benefits the players.

-Eliminating favoritism
Any cases of this? I am pretty sure every players is treated the same.
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 21:23:20


Genghis 
Level 52
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Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 23:15:23


OxTheAutist 
Level 58
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There is very little favouritism, i've experienced. I've personally seen cases of people close to mods get warnings / the like. People are generally very quickly dealt with if they've broken a rule, especially a severe one like breaking rules on coins.
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 23:17:53


Жұқтыру
Level 55
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+1 Fizzer

But often folk for no grounds at all are banned, like Jwilly and GeneralPE. Also, if we take into account about comments I made in bad taste and edited later, I'm definitely too badarse for this site. In addition, it might be nice to have some anti-spam mechanism for the mails (I got totally about 50 different marks from anonym).

Edited 6/5/2016 23:18:56
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 23:18:38


Genghis 
Level 52
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Yes, anonym has been spamming me a bit. I'm just gonna block him .
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 23:21:25


Richard Sharpe 
Level 59
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Can't block him when he just mails from new level 1s every few days...

That is one strange person.
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 23:21:50


Zephyrum 
Level 60
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Good luck with that. His dexterous and strategic proxy alts will come for you. :P

I mailed Fizzer what may be a disastrous solution for his constant spam on me, but hey.

Also, damn, Fizzer went full savage xD #roasted

Edited 6/5/2016 23:22:24
Ban system reform: 6/5/2016 23:51:30


j willy 47
Level 58
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Anonym keeps spamming me too, then reports me when I tell him to go fuck himself lol
Ban system reform: 6/6/2016 01:42:30


Dr. Stupid 
Level 57
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I am also now on Anon's Mail list, but I'm not sure how. I don't recall ever having an interaction with him. (Maybe I should take another look at my comments on his map review?)
Ban system reform: 6/6/2016 01:44:30


Richard Sharpe 
Level 59
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Doc, don't bother. I had no interaction with him either yet he's still blathering away...
Ban system reform: 6/6/2016 10:52:59


Nogals
Level 58
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I disagree Ox, If you look at my thread

Tomateo has of yet not been banned and he has said many horrible things. Once I got banned for saying "who cares". No profanity, just "who cares". Banned for a week. Tomateo uses offensive and racist language several times and nothing happens.

I have been banned many times for reasons that hold no value. Out of all the times that I have been banned only one holds merit, Fizzer would know what Im talking about.
Ban system reform: 6/6/2016 12:51:05


ps 
Level 59
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+1 to fizzer

if you can't play warlight without insulting other players go play something else.

to address your suggestions individually:


-Separate bans
There should be a separate ban from the game and on the forums. The whole point of a ban is to stop someone from doing whatever they were doing, because it was harmful. That harm might have been delivered on the forums, but not on the game, or vice versa. There's no point in banning someone from the whole game when harmful activity was isolated to one medium. This would increase activity, as someone who was banned on the forum would still be playing the game.


if you are beeing toxic to the game, you don't deserve to be anywhere. allowing you entry to one place and not the other would just increase more whinning when warnings and bans are set.


-Ban appeals
There are countless instances when bans were unfair. There should be a ban appeals section on the forums where one can petition a ban to be revoked or reduced. Nothing should be final, opinions change, new evidence comes in. Ban reasons are subjective anyway.


considering most of the people being issued warnings are people who clearly can't behave, you can imagine that channel would mostly be used to vent their immature frustrations. developers have better things to do with their lives then read idiocy complaining about inexcusable behavior. warlight is not a public right, it's a private service.


-Clearly defining rule-violating behavior
"Spamming the chat" is not against the rules according to the rules, but you can be banned for it. WTF? "Disrespect" is too broad and can be applied to almost anything. Players should be able to express some heavy emotions and criticism, too often this falls under the banner of "disrespect." Rules need to be better defined. Also, bans should spell out which rule was violated instead of quoting things you said.


i partly agree with this point, the rules should be more clear and accessible.

then again there are always smarty pants who enjoy finding innovative ways of being annoying and disruptive. these should also be warned and banned appropriately.

there is this thing called netiquette. behave towards others as you would like to be treated. with respect. it's not that hard to follow, you should give it a try.


-Eliminating favoritism
This goes without saying, if every player is going to enjoy the site then players should stop being singled out for personal and political differences in bans. A close-knit group of players who are friends with the admins and don't get banned for ban-worthy behavior are toxic to the community. This tells players who think differently or aren't friends with those guys that they don't matter, and the rules become nothing. If only some players have to follow the rules then the rules are pretty much meaningless.


What favoritism? I've seen top ladder respectable players get warned and banned for the silliest things like calling a known troll an attention whore, or adding bye accounts to a tournament to get it started earlier and someone accuse them of cheating. phyrrus got permbanned without recourse for playing a coin tournament with 2 accounts not knowing it was against the rules.

I say your claims of favoritism are nothing but troll blues.


I'll say this in addition: every report and thread you are creating to whine your sorrows over being a disrespectful person who keeps getting warned and banned without learning anything from it, intoxicating this community with your lack of respect for others. All this effort of yours to prove that you're a bad person, is draining development time from things that would be far more interesting to have improved on warlight. I blame you for slower update times and response times from Fizzer. You suck. If you don't like the warlight ban system go away and don't come back.

Edited 6/6/2016 13:11:31
Ban system reform: 6/6/2016 13:25:49


Richard Sharpe 
Level 59
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I blame you for slower update times and response times from Fizzer.


This.
One hundred times this.
One thousand times this.

Every moment Fizzer has to spend dealing with baseless complaints and whining trolls is time taken away from developing the game.
Ban system reform: 6/6/2016 15:36:13


GeneralPE
Level 56
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behave towards others as you would like to be treated. with respect.

But I don't care or want to be treated with respect. Idc if you call me a cuck.
Ban system reform: 6/6/2016 16:09:06


ps 
Level 59
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GeneralPE: that's your problem. rules exist to ensure everyone has a good time here. if you don't agree to follow them, leave.

Edited 6/6/2016 16:09:49
Ban system reform: 6/6/2016 16:26:53

Rindsay Rohan
Level 47
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+1 Fizzer :)
Ban system reform: 6/6/2016 17:03:38


Death 
Level 59
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+1 ps.

Separate bans on the forum and game itself? If you get banned from one for trolling, there's a high probability you'll start complaining on the other one. There's no point doing that. Much easier to ban someone for good. I agree that bans should be given out carefully, though.

As for ban appeals, they sometimes work. I was banned once and look, I'm here now. Just mail Fizzer for that and he might respond... he doesn't always do that, but there's a chance he will.

then again there are always smarty pants who enjoy finding innovative ways of being annoying and disruptive. these should also be warned and banned appropriately.


This.

Sometimes Fizzer has to act spontaneously. "Disrespect" is a very flexible term and it is here for a purpose. There are countless ways of disrespecting someone and Fizzer can't post them all or correct the rule every time a new kind of disrespect arises. That would be too much unnecessary work.

What favoritism?


To be perfectly honest, I'm pretty sure Fizzer and the mods can't keep up with warning/suspending/banning all the people who deserve it, therefore they only ban people for the crimes they see (like, I coin laundered 6 months before I was actually banned for it). The people who got punished claim it's unfair and while they're partially right, banning all trolls is just impossible. There will be always someone hiding in a shady corner, lurking, waiting for the right moment to jump in. It's not unfair for trolls to get punished, though, but it is unfair for them to not get punished.

But I don't care or want to be treated with respect.


If you want to be disrespectful, there are other places to do that. If the other person doesn't mind, just settle it in private mail. As you post offensive stuff on the forum, other people might get offended too. If you want to talk this way to a certain person (or group of people), just start a private conversation or go to another site where it's allowed. Is it that hard?
Posts 1 - 30 of 64   1  2  3  Next >>   

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