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Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 18:13:52


GeneralPE
Level 56
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Most people agree society is being more and more torn apart over political disagreements. Why is this? Well, in the recent past (after Reconstruction), the differences were mostly over how to fix issues. Everyone pretty much agreed that we should try to keep our people safe and free and prosperous. Today, though, the two parties disagree not on how but on what. Liberals want to make the USA weaker and to help others ahead of our own people. Conservatives want America First and a strong USA. These fundamental goal differences cause extreme discord.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 18:27:01


Richard Sharpe 
Level 59
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Bullshit.

The issue is that people no longer actually discuss matters with people holding other views. Instead, they surround themselves with like-minded individuals until no any differing view is seen as sheer insanity. The ability to communicate so easily with like-minded people via the internet has led to insularity.

How many former friends/acquaintances have you blocked/unfriended on social media when they voiced different views from your own? How many times have you been blocked/unfriended for doing the same?

Everyone surrounds themselves with likeminded individuals so they never see any reason or rationality in the viewpoint of the opposition. Without seeing this, they lose any respect they may have had for the opposition and thus the separation grows and the divide widens. Both sides deal with absolutes and ridiculous stereotypes, refusing to see any legitimacy or nuance in the opposition.

Liberals, conservatives, democrats, republicans. All equally guilty of this divisive behavior.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 18:32:02


Leibstandarte (Vengeance)
Level 40
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My friend is Socialist/Communist (Far-Left)
I am Monarchist/Fascist (Far-Right)

He is one of my best friends.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 18:33:12


GeneralPE
Level 56
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^ I'm not saying you can't be friends, but the divide is growing
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 18:34:36

[FEL]Chatul
Level 22
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^Freedom of thought leads to more diversity in views. For example I hold a weird mix of typical left wing and right wing views. It is sometimes frustrating to see that I disagree with almost everyone but I don't care too much.

For example on abortion I'm pro-life, on cultural diversity I'm against it since I believe we should have a diverse group of individuals as opposed to a diverse group of tribes. I'm neither someone that proposes segregation nor someone that proposes multiculturalism (well this is still segregation). I propose absolute integration by enculturating people with one single good culture (well this can be called brainwashing but all nations practice that). Hence the government must control schools. I'm against too much of humanities and believe people should be taught science and more science in schools. Integrating all Americans into one culture is certainly good for America since it weakens any form of group separatism.

Edited 8/3/2016 18:41:56
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 18:54:23


Imperator
Level 53
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How many former friends/acquaintances have you blocked/unfriended on social media when they voiced different views from your own? How many times have you been blocked/unfriended for doing the same?


I have actually never lost a friend because they have different opinions than I do. Sometimes I meet really angry people who are rude about their opinions and I never talk to them again, but honestly as long as you discuss your opinions respectfully it doesn't matter how different they are.

(I mean It seems like literally everyone here disagrees with me, but as far as I know I haven't made any enemies by refusing to talk to someone with different opinions from me)
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 19:37:08


Rogue Nikolai Krogius
Level 57
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I do agree with the OP. You can sit a Marxist and a Fascist down for coffee and have them talk about their ideas in a civil way but when they get up and leave they will still be a Marxist and a Fascist.

Dialogue only allows different people to understand each other in a way they normally couldn't. It does not bring ideologues them back from the fringe.

Pragmatists are an entirely different story but they are a dying breed.

Edited 8/3/2016 19:38:45
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 19:49:00

[FEL]Chatul
Level 22
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Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 20:38:43


Жұқтыру
Level 55
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In France and to some extent many other countries, what they do is just try and purposefully divise folk into having their politic ideas into faith - and so noone talks about polit and noone really complains about it, since it's societally not ok (generally).
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 22:56:01


Major General Smedley Butler
Level 49
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Facism is not far right, it is far left. Benito Mussolini's fascism was born out of syndicalism, and Woodrow Wilson and Teddy Roosevelt's fascism was inherently leftist as well. Nationalism is not a good definer for whether a specific ideology is far left or far right, just use economic policies for that. I mean, is national bolshevism far right?
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 23:00:27


(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 50
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^Yes and Nazism is just socialism of one ethnic group.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 23:06:42


knyte 
Level 58
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Nazism is called National Socialism, therefore it must be socialism.

North Korea is called the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, therefore it must be a democracy.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 23:08:26


GeneralPE
Level 56
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^ lol strawman
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 23:13:38


knyte 
Level 58
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Speaking of strawmen... this entire post.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 23:27:13


TeamGuns 
Level 58
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@Knyte

Just laughed the crap out of me on that. One of the funniest comments about ideologies I've read in a while.


@Richard Shape

+1000

Very true what you just said. I'm centre-left in economy and very liberal morally speaking, but I watch and read every paper or videos that contradict my opinions with good arguments, because one I don't believe myself to be 100% right in my opinions, and two I would be a hippocrite if I criticized people whom ideologies I know nothing about.

Sometimes I got better talks with conservatives than I did with liberals, all of it depending on wether someone has actual arguments or none. I just try to have ideas of my own based on the knowlage I have; and I'm always eager to be contradicted and change positions if the arguments are solid and based in hard evidence. Too bad we often are reduced to poor arguments like:

Liberals want to make the USA weaker and to help others ahead of our own people. Conservatives want America First and a strong USA.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 23:28:06


OxTheAutist 
Level 58
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@Tabby
Don’t demand anything because of your race, ethnicity, or sex

What about religion?
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 23:38:05


Major General Smedley Butler
Level 49
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Nazism is called National Socialism, therefore it must be socialism.

Nazism has socialist policies implemented into it, with a emphasis on them, therefore it must be inherently socialistic.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/3/2016 23:49:10


(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 50
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^^Being a member of an ethnicity or race or gender is usually not inherently connected to accommodation except for things such as some dark-skinned people of any race needing Vitamin D pills in temperate zones because they have dark skin. For example in a math department we do not need different textbooks, classes or exams for different ethnicities and races and genders(well if the students do not speak English in an English-speaking school we can have language courses and translated materials but it is language proficiency that is the problem, not ancestry).

On the other hand, religious accommodation is usually necessary for an individual to have religious freedom. For example if you do not allow kosher or halal food to be sold you are infringing on the rights to be Jewish or Muslim. However no amount of religious rights of the individual can extend into power over other individuals, especially children of the individual. Most issues with insular religious sects can be solved by mandatory secular education so that people who are in a sect are people who choose to be in one as opposed to this group of people and their offspring who have no choice of religion.

Edited 8/3/2016 23:53:25
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/4/2016 00:16:30


Imperator
Level 53
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Nazism is called National Socialism, therefore it must be socialism.

North Korea is called the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, therefore it must be a democracy.


Technically speaking a "Democratic Republic" is just a republic where elections are held, for which North Korea fits the bill. There is also technically a lot of corruption going on in the elections, but that's a separate issue.

Edited 8/4/2016 00:17:06
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/4/2016 05:30:06


Pulsey
Level 56
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Liberals want to make the USA weaker and to help others ahead of our own people. Conservatives want America First and a strong USA.


Huh, sounds fair enough.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/4/2016 08:24:41


Leibstandarte (Vengeance)
Level 40
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Elections are held in DPRK, Kim Jong-un got %100 of the votes.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/4/2016 11:06:42


Genghis 
Level 52
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#NotAllSocialists #DemocraticSocialism #DailySocialism
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/4/2016 12:36:38


[TNW] Commander Vimes
Level 30
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Nazism is called National Socialism, therefore it must be socialism.

North Korea is called the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, therefore it must be a democracy.


Vegetarians eat vegetables, so humanitarians eat humans
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/7/2016 00:05:15


Spenglerian Traditionalist
Level 47
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fascism isnt far left.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/7/2016 00:07:07


Major General Smedley Butler
Level 49
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Left = economically left
Right = economically right

Fascism is economically left, so sorry bud. Fascism is left wing.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/7/2016 00:09:51


Spenglerian Traditionalist
Level 47
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Fascism is very far right. Fascists support the free market wholeheartedly, the only stipulations being moral.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/7/2016 00:16:21


Major General Smedley Butler
Level 49
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Fascism is opposed to any free market. Hitler, Mussolini, FDR, they were all anti-free market.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/7/2016 00:17:01


Spenglerian Traditionalist
Level 47
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Hitler and FDR weren't fascists, they were socialists. Mussolini didn't oppose the free market.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/7/2016 00:22:24


Major General Smedley Butler
Level 49
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The citizen in the Fascist State is no longer a selfish individual who has the anti-social right of rebelling against any law of the Collectivity. The Fascist State with its corporative conception puts men and their possibilities into productive work and interprets for them the duties they have to fulfill.
- Mussolini


Fascism is opposed to the free market, with it's cartels and heavy regulations.
Why the partisan divide is so large: 8/7/2016 00:24:04


Spenglerian Traditionalist
Level 47
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No it isn't, its opposed to individualism. You don't need to facilitate or support individualism in order to have a free market.

''heavy regulations''

>doesn't give an example.
wew
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