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Defending cultural imperialism: 11/7/2016 19:42:10

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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Unlike racism, cultural imperialism can be a force for good. There are good cultures and bad ones, functional ones and dysfunctional ones. Bad cultures should not be allowed to exist just like pseudoscience and diseases. We should promote good cultures and eliminate bad ones. There is no reason why any bad culture should ever be allowed to exist anywhere on Planet Earth. Good cultures, on the other hand, need to be promoted and if necessary, imposed.

Edited 11/7/2016 19:45:05
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/7/2016 20:19:54


Eklipse {TJC}
Level 57
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That philosophy sounds nice and good until you're the one having a foreign culture imposed on you at gunpoint
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/7/2016 20:23:38

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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^What kind of culture? Cultural imperialists usually have relatively good cultures, from ancient Greece to Imperial China to the British Empire. Real barbarians usually don't promote cultural imperialism. They just murder people. You don't see any culture imposed by the Mongol Empire for example. Instead Mongols gradually adapted relatively good local cultures (such as Iranian and Turkish ones).

Edited 11/7/2016 20:26:36
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/7/2016 20:32:33

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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^^The term "foreign culture" makes no sense. I can argue that most currently existing cultures have been influenced by what used to be considered "foreign" or even "hostile". For example Christianity isn't native to Europe and Africa, yet white Europeans (even some nationalists!) and black sub-Saharan Africans don't consider them something alien. Islam isn't native to Iran and Malaysia, yet they still practice them without it being considered un-Iranian or un-Malay. Most languages use some variant of the Phoenician alphabet (more accurately abjad) but we never see people complaining that Latin, Cyrillic, Greek and Arabic alphabets/abjad are somehow foreign outside Lebanon.

All cultures, no matter how alien they look, can become "native". Hence it does not make sense to call them "foreign" to begin with. For example if the Wahhabi entity is secularized their grandchildren won't remember gender segregation, Wahhabism or the patriarchy as much as you do not remember and like the culture of Medieval England/Germany/wherever your ancestors are from. Instead they will consider secularism as something native in Arabian peninsula.

Edited 11/7/2016 20:37:50
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/7/2016 21:26:22


Darth Darth Binks
Level 56
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^What kind of culture?
The Spanish.
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/7/2016 21:31:05

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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^Compared to human sacrifices in Americas the Spanish culture was good.

Many seculars don't like Christianity and Islam. However they are indeed better than some pre-Christian and pre-Islamic cultures that sacrificed humans.

Edited 11/7/2016 21:37:42
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/7/2016 21:33:07


Eklipse {TJC}
Level 57
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The Nazis and Soviets were both cultural imperialists who wanted the entire world to adopt their ideology and culture. Those who refused were met with brutal force
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/7/2016 21:36:12

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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^National Socialists were racists, not global cultural imperialists. Otherwise we should have seen them promoting a separate National Socialist Polish Workers Party for Poles or admitted them into the NSDAP. NSDAP was in essence only cultural imperialist among Germans and friendly nations (such as the Independent State of Croatia)

Soviets were indeed global cultural imperialists. However their culture was indeed not very good. The Soviet culture was exported despite being bad because it was very united and was willing to sacrifice human lives to export its own culture. This is the same feature Islamism has. This problem can be fixed through global promotion of individualism.

Edited 11/7/2016 21:42:13
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/7/2016 22:07:31


Von Jewburg
Level 35
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Cultures are cultures. As long as a minority culture is willing to adapt to the majority or vice versa to prevent conflict, I don't care whether you eat salamanders as part of a religious ceremony.
Oh yeah, and cultural imperialism? No. I'm fine with different people, and your conformity-based world would be very boring. Cultures do not have any sort of "god-given right" to expand themselves, because both the "superior" and "inferior" culture are human beings.
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/7/2016 22:10:32

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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^I disagree. I don't view cultures as things that are inherently connected to a part of humanity, usually defined by ancestry or location. It's true that cultures are statistically related to certain pseudo-ancestry-based groups of people within a short time, cultures of one pseudo-ancestry-based group have usually changed a lot over time.

There are certainly superior cultures and inferior cultures. It is absurd to believe that the German culture is equal to the Chechen one considering what these two cultures have done, for example. People indoctrinated with inferior cultures are victims of such cultures and it's good for them to be assimilated into better cultures.

All humans are equal. Not all ideas. Cultures are ideas, not people.

Edited 11/7/2016 22:27:44
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 02:14:05

[FEL]Chatul
Level 22
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Most people on the left may not have realized this. However, cultural imperialism is a powerful antidote to racism. That's why racists of any race hate that.

By the way, multiculturalism is just rebranded segregationism that racists love. Someone may want to argue that academia for example is multicultural. In reality it is not. It is just multiracial (aka Eurasian) but it is still one single culture. It has a common language that people are expected to speak and write (English), common behaviors that people display even if they come from Italy or Japan. It encourages secularism even though some religions are de facto accommodated more than others. (For example Judaism isn't accommodated outside Israel at all in academia since researchers meet on the Shabbat. Islam isn't accommodated either due to the lack of halal food.) The only supposedly multicultural part is that people are sometimes multilingual (but still speak English) and vegan food is always available. In essence the global STEM community is not very different from Massachusetts. Multiculturalism is evil.

Edited 11/8/2016 02:18:30
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 02:36:21

SmarterThanOne
Level 8
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Why should anyone have a 'right' to other people believing in the same things as them? Cultures have no place outside of statistical study of groups in a academic setting. You should have no say in what ideas your neighbor has, providing they aren't shooting you with a gun or chopping your hand off.

If your neighbor and other people think its cool to talk in a weird dialect, wear a boot on their heads and convene on March 2nd to celebrate kolobonoko day, how is that your business? Who cares if its superior or inferior? Who is deciding what makes a culture superior anyway? lmfao If everyone starts wearing a boot you do not have a right to not be the only person to not wear a boot.
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 02:51:20


Von Jewburg
Level 35
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^
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 03:16:32


Major General Smedley Butler
Level 49
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So Poland, back in the good old days of Polish superpower status, they were racist because they let in Muslims? Woah better kill them, much less racist.
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 06:09:22

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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You mean the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth?
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 06:14:43

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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@SmarterThanOne There are clearly evil cultural practices and counterproductive ones. For example a culture that condones rape is just a culture that needs to be fixed, not respected. A culture that hates education isn't evil but it is certainly not optimal.

The stuff that I talk about aren't superficial traits such as hats, dates of holidays, etc. A culture in Massachusetts is not bad because it decides to wear like the Haredim during winter if they think it keeps themselves warm, for example.

There are objective criteria to determine whether a culture is good. Economy, individual freedom and science are good indications. The Chechen culture, for example, lags behind most Russians in living standards, does not promote individual freedom of women or children, or have a reasonable number of scientists. Hence it is a bad culture. The British culture on the other hand is good since the British are reasonably rich, has individual freedom and has done a great amount of science. The same applies to the German culture, the New England culture, the non-Orthodox Ashkhenazi Jewish culture, etc.

Edited 11/8/2016 06:22:17
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 06:25:41

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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For example if you could choose to be a German or a Chechen, I'm pretty sure that you would like to be a German. That's because you intuitively know that the German culture is better.

More examples:
Poles and Saudis. I would choose Poles. Poles have a real economy, personal freedom and science.
Iranians and Saudis. They are closer but I would probably choose Iranians. Iran has its share of good scientists and it is less restrictive than Saudis. Furthermore Saudis can't sustain themselves if they run out of oil or oil becomes less important.
Filipinos and Vietnamese. Vietnamese are much better. More tendency to learn and higher levels of scientific development. In the long run I don't think Filipinos can compete with the Vietnamese unless they radically change their culture. Neither have a lot of personal freedom due to the patriarchy so in this aspect they are equally bad.
Tamils and Pashtuns. Tamils. The former has produced more scientists than the latter. Both patriarchic but Hindu Tamils are much less ossified than devoted Muslim Pashtuns. Tamils are also probably going to be richer than Pashtuns in the long run.

Edited 11/8/2016 06:37:54
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 16:29:08


Von Jewburg
Level 35
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Chechens are pretty cool. And so are Germans.

We have had crazy Chechens and crazy Germans. Beneficial Chechens and beneficial Germans.
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 18:03:02

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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^There is a difference. The Chechen culture is not as good as the German one. Otherwise you wouls have seen Chechen scientists getting the Nobel Prize and Chechenya as rich as at least Dagestan.

Edited 11/8/2016 18:03:13
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 18:26:07


[FEL] The Prince of Felidia
Level 55
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TAGGY IS A DIPLO CHEAT
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 19:14:58

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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^No I'm not. My diplos are very different from regular ones in rules.

In a Congolese diplo not all players have the same conditions for victory. Also there is no declaration of war since officially Uganda and Rwanda are not at war with the Congolese gov just like IRL.

Edited 11/8/2016 19:15:56
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 19:17:51


The Dalek
Level 45
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Why you so mean to Tabby, [FEL]? He was always nice to you in our felidae forums.
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 19:21:10


Major General Smedley Butler
Level 49
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There's two million Chechens and eighty million Germans, of course they differ in the number of scientists.
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 19:29:12

(((Tabby Juggernaut)))
Level 51
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^And..certainly not 1:4.

By saying that the Chechen culture is not as good as the German one I'm not bashing the Chechens as people. Instead I'm saying that they need to change their culture.

Edited 11/8/2016 19:39:02
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/8/2016 23:23:31


Жұқтыру
Level 55
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The Chechen culture is not as good as the German one. Otherwise you wouls have seen Chechen scientists getting the Nobel Prize and Chechenya as rich as at least Dagestan.


1. Thinking the Nobel Prize by land counts for anything.
2. Not taking the real takeaway (by your laws) from this and not being a Nordish nationalist.
3. Thinking that Chechens don't get as many prizes is 100% based on culture, and y'know, not less funding for sciences, having a dirtpoor folk (the median wage in the Chechen Respublic is about the same as in Bangladesh), not being in a war, canning learn, having internet ties, so on.
Defending cultural imperialism: 11/9/2016 07:28:29


[FEL] The Prince of Felidia
Level 55
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^^^He is a bs cheater
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