Dear Conservative folk who are against Transgender folk existing and them being allowed to change.

Do not try to say you support the beliefs of the founding fathers if you are against these folk existing. If you are in support of the government going in and stopping a doctor from doing changes to a person, you are violating not just the free market which you claim to support, you are denying folk their property rights. Their right to modify and do what they wish to their property (their bodies). You are no different than the large government you claim to oppose stopping someone from starting a garden in their front yard, or refusing to allow someone to convert a rifle to a different caliber.

So please, before you start your staunch defense of tradition (something the founding folk opposed doing), either be ideologically consistent or stop saying you defend small government and liberty.

NC

butt wut if dey tri 2 mo-less mi in da washy rooms!!!!!!1/??

boi mmmm..

Edited 4/24/2016 23:14:55

If a guy wants to put on a dress and wig and call himself a woman, fine. If someone wants to mutilate their body with some surgery, fine. Those are their prerogative.

However, nobody else is obligated to indulge them in their gender delusions. Society is not obligated to re-adjust itself for them either.

Bufflo izz rihgte wat abwougt disse poepel dat mollests kats in washy roomz doas note sunds gudz.

Someone is not sane here.

The society? What is the society? Governments? They have no right to impose their will on folk. Folk around them? They have no right to impose their will upon other folk. Culture? Culture must give way to freedom or it will be used to support illogical and idiotic things, like the illegalization of plants and plant products, keeping folk from skin mixing, etc.

Folk around them? They have no right to impose their will upon other folk.

My point went over your head it seems. I was saying that transgenders don't have the right to impose their will on non-transgenders.

A man can call himself a woman or vice-versa, but they have no right to force me or others to indulge them. A minority group has no place throwing its weight and bullying around the majority.

First off, this isn't about government owned restrooms (they are paid for by theft of production, and are inherently immoral).

Secondly, a transgender person can't force their will upon another by using the other person's property without consent, as no one can do that while being morally right.

You have failed to define what you think them imposing will upon others is, so don't get mad when I can't argue against something I don't perceive.

I think he means forcing the imagination of Transgender upon others.

Regarding majority/minority, thus is the Constitution, an attempt at balancing minority rule and majority rule.

And why shouldn't this be treated as a mental disease exactly? WHat causes someone to want to become "trans"?

Why shouldn't it be treated as a mental disease? Because it doesn't impair folk significantly.

But it does. People pay fairly large sums of money to get the sex change, and many don't "come out" because of fear of persecution. That in turn can cause depression and even suicide.

If a guy wants to put on a dress and wig and call himself a woman, fine. If someone wants to mutilate their body with some surgery, fine. Those are their prerogative.

However, nobody else is obligated to indulge them in their gender delusions. Society is not obligated to re-adjust itself for them either.

+, but the government should officially change their gender in the files if their gender has changed.

They have no right to impose their will on folk.

A government's rights depend on who you ask, some will say more, some will say less. Don't do as if its clearly meant. Some laws are needed, I don't want to legalise someone shooting me.

Why shouldn't it be treated as a mental disease? Because it doesn't impair folk significantly.

It makes them want to mutilate their sexorgans and throats and hate themselves as the sex organs they were born with...imagine if I said I really feel like I'm more a 9-fingered fellow born inside an 10-fingered one, so I need to cut off that 10th finger, and start wearing an eyepatch since that's what 9-fingered folk do, and walk naked every day, since that's what 9-fingered folk do.

NO! That's not what 9-fingered do, it's just stereotypes that this fellow fits in, and so he wants to have surgery to cut his finger off.

You have failed to define what you think them imposing will upon others is

The attempts at forcing others to use "preferred pronouns". Attempting to use political pressure into forcing others to agreeing with their delusion. You might see someone who is obviously a man, but they claim they're a woman, and if you refuse to agree that they are a woman you'll be tar and feathered as an evil bigot for not going along with the fantasy.

Why shouldn't it be treated as a mental disease? Because it doesn't impair folk significantly.

It causes them to damage their bodies with potentially harmful hormone treatments and surgeries. It also causes intense delusions that hurts their ability to function socially. Transgenderism is definitely a mental disorder. People who have it shouldn't be treated badly for it, but at the same time, focus should be on treating the disorder and not indulging it.

You might see someone who is obviously a man, but they claim they're a woman, and if you refuse to agree that they are a woman you'll be tar and feathered as an evil bigot

Ok, frankly, it's not like this in America. Christians aren't being systematically persecuted, the liberal elite don't curb freedom of speech, oh wait, that's the conservatively backed FBI.

Don't be melodramatic.

Edited 4/25/2016 02:08:32

Mutilate is a subjective thing, is cutting your toenails or shaving your beard mutilation? Or how about tatooing your skin?
And most of the time, transgender folk can function well enough to cooperate with others, produce and live.

If lots of folk don't like you, who cares? If a business can't employ you without losing business so they have to fire you, guess what, the free market just spoke.

Mutilation: "To physically harm as to impair use"

Your beard and toenails will grow back, and you can use them...however you'd use toenails. And even tattoos can be erased, but it's still very dumb of anyone to get one, but not clinically dumb, as you still have skin, and it still does it's job: holding your insides in.

But you cut off a penis, that's it. It can't be used. Same thing with throat surgery.

Ok, frankly, it's not like this in America.

Yes, it is. You've obviously never stepped foot on a U.S college campus, or any setting dominated by liberal-leaning individuals. Refuting transgenderism will make you a persona non grata very fast.

Christians aren't being systematically persecuted

That's a debatable point. However, it's also one I never made. Where in my posts did I even bring religion into this discussion? This isn't about Christians.

the liberal elite don't curb freedom of speech

Are you joking? They obviously do. The liberal elite are consistently using political correctness to stomp out any view points that doesn't fit with the progressive mainstream. CEOs have been forced to step down for opposing gay marriage, companies have been boycotted for not supporting LGBT groups, college administrators have their careers ruined if they don't meet the social justice standard. It's happening left and right.

Freedom of speech is definitely on the decline in the U.S, even though most aren't willing to admit it.

oh wait, that's the conservatively backed FBI.

The FBI doesn't take your job away for criticizing Christianity. The FBI doesn't ostracize you from public life for your political leanings. They might partake in some censorship, but it's on a different wavelength than what we're discussing here.

Don't be melodramatic.

I'm not, I'm being straight-forward.

The leftists can think you're a idiot, and not buy from your business , why should they be forced to buy from you or not protest you?

The FBI is on a different wavelength. They monitor you, try putting you in jail and have killed lots of folk while being funded by legalized extortion.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2013/06/19/us/in-150-shootings-the-fbi-deemed-agents-faultless.html?referer=

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/oregon-occupiers-ambushed-highway-lavoy-finicum-killed-cold-blood-hands-up/

And these are just modern killings, they've been violent murderers since inception, and used for political ends since inception, too.