I didn't study it, I've just played hundreds of games on 3v3 Euro.

1v1 strat is good because it is the single most-played template. That means that tertiary strategies can be developed on it, and you don't have to devote a whole lot of attention, because it is so familiar.

Psy is predominantly a 3v3 euro player, ive seen a few 1v1 games with him and he has no idea what hes doing (love you psy).

Well, i must have played less than 50 games in 1vs1 Medium Earth and only one time with you 1 year ago. Judging my 1vs1 abilities on this single template with this very small sample is pointless. Also the whole range of possible templates that Warlight provides isn't summarized with the only 1vs1 ME.

I don't like 1vs1 ME at all and i won't pretend to be good at this, like i don't think someone who has less than 50 games on 3vs3 Euro could expect anything on this. Almost every time i see a good 1vs1 player, but clearly inexperienced in team games, joining a 3vs3 it's a disaster.

To refocus the debate i don't see any valid argument to say that playing 1vs1 games makes you a better player than playing team games. I even think the contrary, team games are much more complex because you can't only focus on your own play, you have to consider every action of your teammates and coordination is required to be efficient. Also you face situations you will never encounter in 1vs1 like dealing with multiple opponents at the same time with an inferior income.

I am so confused...

dead piggy said:

(...)who is as bad at 1v1 as I am at 3v3(...)

yet he has a lot to tell us about team games...

To add to the current discussion:

What 1vs1 me teaches:
- counterpicking
- smart picking order
- using order delay moves
- efficient expansion routes
- being agressive on board
- how to minimise rock/papar/scissors outcomes
- on higher level picking strategies have to incorporate psychology at some point
- finding dominant strategies in simple scenarios

What team games (primarily 3vs3 eu, but any good team game):
- efficient picking
- efficient expansion
- risk management
- how to minimise luck involvement
- efficient evaluation of any position
- coordination
- map balance
- using order delay moves
- understanding deeply how small changes affect the game (change turkey to 5 on europe and it'll move up 10-15 picks up)
- understanding opponents' position
- picking the right plan after pick (in 1vs1 you are either stuck with one plan after picks or have max 1-2 decisions around turn 3-4)
- finding dominant strategies in complicated scenarios (as Psy mentioned for example effective stalling with inferior income or playing 1vs3 with superior income is not really that easy)
- on higher level picking incorporates minimal psychology if anything, 3vs3 scenarios allow you to diverse risk in such a way that trying to counter is not needed most of the time
- how to give maximum resistance (more recoverability in 1vs1 meaning advantage requires more precise play to turn advantage into a win )
- more people = more fun? (except for boot thingy)


To sum up I guess it is in general linked to the discussion what makes the best player. I always used a very easy thought process:
The best player is the one that looking at a tournament page you don't want to be paired against in 1st round and you want him as your teammate before others. Using that rule of thumb, I'd take 3vs3 player over 1vs1 player any day.

x i just remembered i'm 3-0 up against you in EU 3v3s on my other account, yet you seem to be able to come up with so many strategies How did that happen :D

Your mother raped a homeless Chinese guy, around 10 years and 9 months later you joined warlight, and then beat me in 3 3v3 games. But I haven't come up with any strategies, you dribbling skunk :D

Hell's bells, you're worse than warlightvet.

wow thanks for talking a gamr that was what... half a year ago? You really are a rat and have no life to remember such an old game.

- Dicklover (or whatever your original name was) to warlightvet - 03/29/2013 00:01:42

Your mother raped a homeless Chinese guy

Gui i told you not to tell anyone about that day.
*breaks into tears*

Nosy kitty heard it from gui because he is nosy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNRNCk3YwqE 2:50

I'm sorry ... it's hard to come back from that, but I'm sorry.

Gui i told you not to tell anyone about that day.

Uh ... wha? Ironheart = pulsey? So confused.

Also, I'm utterly horrified that you mistook me for Gui.

what, these aren't strategies? :P

There are about 30 bonuses on the Europe map. 24 are chosen at the start of the game. In my opinion, the best 24 starts are usually pretty obvious. Depending on the random warlord, you can usually rule out the Ukraine, Italy, Turkey, Greece, Poland, Romania.

So if each player is playing as well as possible, they should each choose the same 24 starts, meaning every single one of them should get a bonus over 18th.

If there are any variations, I would really expect them to be above 18th place. If there are significant variations between players in the order of the top 24, what that suggests is that the order you pick them in is pretty much arbitrary.

We all know the feeling on 3v3 Euro where you get 1+ useless counter(s) to a bonus that your teammate ended up getting. Probably, each of the 6 players picked those 2+ spots somewhere in the order. It's effectively random.

I agree with Gui's post 45 minutes ago (man this thread is moving fast), I prefer the Classic 3v3 with cities distribution, and am sad it has fallen out of fashion so dramatically. Frankly, automatic distribution with 5 territories each would be preferable to what there is now.

dont you feel any shame about losing to a 10 year old, X?

and i'm not as bad as warlightrat, he actually went back to the games that were months old and looked into the exact detail. :P

sorry that was by CHinaman^ i keep forgetting which account i'm on o.O

Please stick to one, it makes it easier to ignore you.

you just failed :P

This thread has been dead for a while but even so I'll post an update here.

Today I had been playing a 3vs3 game 60% prerequistes with myhand,szeweningen,Gnuffone,Malamute and x-apex (kitty now). I don't know why but seemingly guys like to state how superior they are and such so we discussed about that a bit.
In the course of this discussion we came to quite a funny demanding bet.
I, refusing to believe women are "per definition" worse then men, challenged them to a best out of 3.
The men...believing themselves superior...accepted.

What would be the stakes ?? If I lost I would join WM if two men from WM could beat me. But if those men lost, they would change their alliance to Relite.
Seeing as we're going to have a challenge coming up soon this of course had it's advantages.
Myhand didn't want me to join any alliance but as is his want...he wanted me to change my name to something funny or such. If he lost though, he would also become a Relite member.
X-apex...sorry to say buddy, I just didn't think you would be an added value in Relite + I'm not so fond of stalkers so yeah.

Anyway the games:
1) First off was against sweningen. To my suprise it was easier then I expected and I still can't believe my picks turned out so well:
Game 1 - Szeweningen specifically asked me not to post this game since it was such an embarassing loss for him. I don't know how he managed to make that misclick in Africa, but he had ruined it from the start. As you can see Szewingen, I keep my word
Game 2 - http://warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=4078292

2-0!!
Welcome to Relite szeweningen!

2)Second opponent was Malamute. To be fair I expected Malamute to be the easiest of the 3 opponents. He's a good player, but just not yet up to par with the other 3:
Game 1 - http://warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=4078412
Game 2 - http://warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=4078498

2-0!!
Welcome to Relite Malamute!

3)Third opponent was myhandisonfire,one of the legends. Even though I wouldn't risk losing my tie with Relite in this match I certainly wasn't happy with the possible names myhand could come up with. Anyway, the game:
Game 1 - http://warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=4078617

Seemingly this one was adjourned for more "pressing" matters
Will be continued?

4)My last, but not least, opponent was Gnuffone. Knowing that szeweningen + Malamute had already lost I was safe. On the other hand, having such a player join Relite, would be a great boost. I knew it wasn't going to be easy for Gnuffone has really improved a lot over the last few months. Even so, here are the results:
Game 1 - http://warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=4078687
Game 2 - http://warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=4078783
Game 3 - http://warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=4078954

2-1 for me, making me victorious in best out of 3.
Alas, Gnuffone took back his promise at the last moment. Unexpected and annoying to be fair. On the other hand, I can't force him against his will.


So...things being as they are now it seems like Relite got at least 2 new members and maybe a better shot at winning the challenge.

Well, that was unexpected even to me...

Screw it, I'm not joining.. it was meant to be strat 1v1, not cities distribution imperium romanum, which means you still are just 1:0 against me.

:(

this one's for you, aranka: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qb_hqexKkw8

Awesome job Aranka, alway glad to see stereotypes be broken. :)
I'll be interested to see how this plays out.

You're a credit to your gender.

"Szeweningen specifically asked me not to post this game"
Why would you agree to that? I cannot, CANNOT believe sze picks in that second game. If he was even more embarassed about a different game, then I *must* see it. I see Sze has been promoted to a member of the prestigious relite clan. I know he's been striving for this for a long time, im glad they finally accepted you Sze. Well done bro! I hope Gnuffone and malamute have the humility to join you soon.

But in all seriousness aranka, post tits or get the fuck out.