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Infinity Premier League: 1/15/2016 14:23:18


Linberson of Gilead
Level 56
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confirm_team 2v2 linfinity
Infinity Premier League: 1/15/2016 17:22:06


Kenny • apex 
Level 59
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@Knyte: Consider making a spreadsheet page titled Overview that'll give us the podiums on each ladder (1st,2nd,3rd) and their points etc.
Infinity Premier League: 1/15/2016 17:30:26


Fleecemaster 
Level 59
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Infinity Premier League: 1/15/2016 17:43:30


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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The top 3 consolidated onto a single sheet? I'll put that on the horizon; messing around with a few other things atm (as you can see).

- set minimum requirement of 5 games to get ranked

- teams with PENDING/unconfirmed players are no longer given points (sorry, Fleece/Genghis)

- clans are now visible for each player

More stuff is on the way.

Added a rudimentary Overview sheet; will add more to it soon.

Player names are now hyperlinked to their profile.

Edited 1/15/2016 18:00:24
Infinity Premier League: 1/15/2016 18:11:23

Master Bjarke
Level 64
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 set_limit 1v1 MasterBjarke 2 
Infinity Premier League: 1/15/2016 18:34:30


Fleecemaster 
Level 59
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Why is the ranking messed up atm? Or is that cos you're still fixing something?

Wait...

I'm such a dunce! That's players who haven't played their 5 matches yet!!!

Maybe change "none" to "unranked"?

Perhaps hide the score, or at least the colour as well? Or maybe put them on a different sheet? Just to make it less confusing...

Edited 1/15/2016 18:55:31
Infinity Premier League: 1/15/2016 20:00:01


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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unranked is too long for the field; none is just short enough so I went with it (N/A looked weird).

Not sure if I'm going to go with this setup; I can take out the conditional formatting for the ratings but I wanted something akin to WL's setup of "Not yet ranked with a rating of 420"; I'm still using the ratings to determine matchups.
Infinity Premier League: 1/15/2016 20:21:53

Omniscient 
Level 56
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I definitely prefer showing unranked peoples ratings. Is there an advantage for first pick btw? I assume not.

Rating advantage I mean, guessing you're doing basic bayeselo but with average rating of 2000 as opposed to 1500 like on the 1v1 ladder.
Infinity Premier League: 1/15/2016 20:25:32


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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No, there's no adjustment for first pick advantage, largely because I prefer simpler statistical models and in the long run things should even out. It's also a bit tricky to calculate the effects of first pick advantage across so many templates.
Infinity Premier League: 1/15/2016 20:56:25


Aura Guardian 
Level 62
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set_limit 1v1 AuraGuardian 5
Infinity Premier League: 1/16/2016 04:54:40

[wolf]japan77
Level 57
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@Knyte, wouldn't first pick advantage only apply to games in which the picks overlapped?, as such it may take quite a few games to balance out.

Also, if you don't account for it, due to the fact that certain players will get the advantage more commonly than others, and also new players may have a minor advantage due to the fact that they haven't played long enough to have it even out, that certain players will inherently have an slightly inaccurate ranking?

That being said, wouldn't it be possible to figure out how the current ladder system uses it, and apply to those templates, and then try to apply them to the others, as free time arrives?
(Please note: I really haven't tried to understand how the ladders currently work, I'm just assuming they consider first pick advantage)
Infinity Premier League: 1/16/2016 06:03:20


Kenny • apex 
Level 59
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@japan: Most templates you should end up overlapping some picks even if it's not in the first 3. Also consider cyclic order which a couple templates may have. I honestly don't think there's a bias to first pick. I see myself usually hoping for second pick more often than first unless there's a particularly OP territory on the board that's pickable.

Atm, the ladder accounts for it by a base rating boost/padding. I forget the exact number but it's pretty low.

Edited 1/16/2016 06:04:33
Infinity Premier League: 1/16/2016 06:08:08

[wolf]japan77
Level 57
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I'm just suggesting Ideas, I also note that the difference would be extremely small, but may be critical if two players are equally good at a template, as they should have the same rating.
Infinity Premier League: 1/16/2016 11:29:20


Fleecemaster 
Level 59
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It will even itself out in the end, as knyte says, it's not worth the hassle of calulating a factor.
Infinity Premier League: 1/16/2016 18:44:31


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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So I agree with Kenny; I also think it varies heavily by template.

First-pick adjustment seems to be something just pulled from chess (where there's a clear first-move advantage) but I haven't seen any good statistical measurements establishing anything of that sort in Warlight (especially when move order is cyclic here). I could start tracking first-pick "advantage" (P(team wins|player gets first pick) - P(team wins|team doesn't get first pick) and convert that into an Elo adjustment (which is pretty trivial, since Elo can be directly converted into probability), but that data would have to be collected from the league itself.

Given that the query game API is absolute shit in terms of how many games it can be run on (nearly 0 in this league as I've had to manually create them to bypass create game API restrictions), that's going to have to be saved for another day.

Edited 1/16/2016 20:54:40
Infinity Premier League: 1/16/2016 23:20:11


MightySpeck (a Koala) 
Level 60
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set_limit 1v1 MS 3
Infinity Premier League: 1/16/2016 23:53:32


knyte
Level 55
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Anyone know a simple algorithm (ideally one I could express as a formula) I could use to determine the maximum possible number of games given an array of players and the remaining # of games they could play at one time?

The current method is a bit inaccurate (especially for small groups) and it bothers me.

Really, the main edge case is when a league has only one player who's got a limit of 2 or greater. Obviously, the max # of possible games is 0 but the current set up (divide by 2) thinks it's 1.

Edited 1/17/2016 00:01:15
Infinity Premier League: 1/17/2016 00:03:18


Fleecemaster 
Level 59
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Max games = n(x)/2

Where n = number of players

x = max number of games each player wants to play (Edit: you might need to take an average to get this number if everyone is set differently)

Edit2: I think I see what you're talking about, you have to add in this condition:

if (n <= x) then {x = n - 1}

because n(n-1)/2 is the absolute maximum allowed number of connections in a set of nodes.

Edited 1/17/2016 00:12:29
Infinity Premier League: 1/17/2016 00:28:50


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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Ah true. I can set n to the number of players with limits that are > 0 and then it should work. Can't think of edge cases where it wouldn't.
Infinity Premier League: 1/17/2016 00:35:37


Fleecemaster 
Level 59
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So long as x is less than n, and n isn't 0, the formula works fine. I think it's a case of handling those smaller values with extra checks.

With 2 players left the max can only be 1 game (2*1)/2 = 1

Also when doing checks I would pair up all those with a limit of 1 game first, then 2, then 3, etc. I think that gives you the best outcome, if you're not already :)
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