Every nation is a threat to every nation, including itself. Except Switzerland. Those people will f**k you up.

Middle east has been at war since the beginning of time.

I can see where the self-research road ends and the government education begins.

I never said that would be the case

You implied via loaded terms such as "greatest threat to humanity."

You are so naive that you even believe that North Korea is considered a threat. It's not a threat at all

South Korea and Japan would disagree with that.

You can continue to indulge in your absurd irrational world view
You simply have no idea what you are talking about.
since you dont have the intellectual capacity to understand any of my explanations.

Wow, more ad hominem and personal attacks. Well done. You can't make yourself understand a different point of view other than your own so you settle with "oh well they're just stupid." I applaud the elitism. Do you even know how to be civil in a debate? At this point I don't think you do.

I agree that our arguing is pointless though. You already think your viewpoint on the world is 100% correct and superior and that anyone who disagrees with you is an idiot. Your arguments while including some fact tend to be 50% or more ad-hominem based.

@Eklipse {TJC}

1. I dont blindly hate America like I don't hate America just because its America. I gave you the reasons why I dislike America in my previous reply.

2. America did cause many of the world problems, Al Qaida was funded and armed by America which was part of the Mujahideen during the Afghan Soviet war, when America invaded Iraq for the false claim of weapons of mass destruction, the invasion killed more then 113,728 civilians and destabilized the region and when US soldiers left Iraq they left a lot of US weapons which then ISIS came from Syria and took the weapons, same thing with Libya destabilized because of the NATO intervention. I am not blaming America for all the world problems just much of the world problems.

3. Yes there are also other countries that did a lot of bad things like North Korea, Russia and Israel for example, but nobody gets close as bad as America I mean for fuck sake America has bombed more then 27 countries since WW2. Has Russia and China bombed that many countries since WW2? America has a detention camp called Guantanamo bay in Cuba which tortures prisoners which btw 20% are proven to be innocent but are not still not released. It almost as bad North Korea's prison camps. And you still question why so many people hate America.

4. Well and you accuse for blindly hating America, when I gave you reason why I dislike America more then Europe or China. Its good that you also see that America has problems but you don't understand why people hate America more then other countries, but I agree with you on that some people do blindly hate only America

5. You tell me to stop with the double standard when you country was founded on double standard, I mean your country was founded by a group of slave owners that wanted to be free and say'd that all people were created equal, ah yeah except for Indians, blacks and woman right?

6. I wont reply back because I see this discusion going no where same as this thread and you will probably call my a blind American hater, I don't think I am superieur I am just a guy with my own opinion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5rVD_TXrjo
(Top 10 US-Backed Atrocities and Authoritarian Regimes)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsL6mKxtOlQ
(George Carlin on The American Dream)

Edited 3/19/2015 15:05:44

Lol Ottoman, way to pussy out on the argument

Ottoman Empire,

Firstly, yes it's true that ISIS took U.S weapons, but those weapons were originally given to the Iraqi government. Regimes in Iraq and Libya were both toppled in the hope of a more democratic government being established, you can't blame the U.S that the successor governments in these countries have been incompetent.

Secondly, Russia and China have committed just as many crimes as the U.S in the past century if not more. The main difference is that Russia (More so when it was part of U.S.S.R) and China tend to abuse their own people rather than fight in other countries.

Lastly, the founding of the U.S is irrelevant to the current conversation. There weren't many progressive countries in the world at the time of 1776. Most European countries still allowed slavery at the time and Spain was one of the biggest supporters of the slave trade. You'd be hard pressed to find a great place for women in this time frame as well. All of Europe was racist and sexist at one point as well. Don't use ancient history as argument against a modern country.

You can reply or not, I don't really care.

@{101st}Lawlz

No I dont pussy out if you read my reply I said that I saw this argument going no where and im just wasting my time because Eklipse is going to suck Americas and defend it no matter how many bad things it because he's a puppet. He says that China and Russia did more crimes than America in the past century which is totally bullshit, yeah the reason why Russia and China dont fight in other countries is because they are smart and do not waste 1,7 trillion dollars which was spend on the Iraq war which as you could see was totally worth because look how peacefull Iraq now is God Bless Bush.
Btw Eklipse the reason why the U.S. invaded Iraq was because at first they said that Saddam Hussein had something to do With 9/11 and then they changed and said he had weapons of mass destrucion which was also not true it is the U.S fault why Libya and Iraq are a shithole now because if the U.S didn't topple the governments to begin with and bombing civilians which made the population of Iraq and Libya more radical is the reasons why these are failed states now. The fact your even defending U.S for Iraq War is mindblowing.





Edited 3/19/2015 21:19:06

You can reply or not, I don't really care.

False.

the iraq picture hasnt changed; if anything, it looks better

Eklipse, name a bigger detrimental force on the world than the USA. I can't think of one since Hitler's Third Reich, and even that isn't unarguable.

@ OttomanEmpire

Really like your stance on Libya. "Oh Gaddafi's not a terrible and oppressive ruler. LOOK AT THESE BUILDINGS! Could someone evil have buildings like that? And look! Caaaaars"

Way to play into the stereotype Arun. You're a real britbong now :p

I have family and friends in the US and I love them to pieces, but man they're ignorant. I know very few Americans that are even mildly well informed about the events going on outside of their own town, much less their own country (unless it's about terrorism, war or Obama).

I can't even hold a decent political or economic debate with those who went to college (all that tuition and the majority didn't seem to really absorb anything from it). Seeing how most American's form their arguments, rebuttals and one-liners on this and other threads, they have no clue how economics work and don't understand the magnitude of the US's impact on the rest of the world.

(Fear not! This is a generalization, I know there are a few of your out there who are truly capable of critical thinking, but you're the exception not the rule!)

In other words, myhand, feel free to keep the threads coming, but stop expecting to get through to these guys. If they believed for a second their government was even remotely as corrupt as it is, then they would have packed their bags and headed to Canada long ago.

Those of you who studied history, even badly, should know that the US is comparable with Nazi Germany (systematic eradication of Native Americans, preemptive invasion of non-aggressive nations), Stalinist Russia (Patriot Acts, NSA, etc) and Maoist China (domination through political, economic and military means of neighboring regions. Ethnic cleansing by promoting demographic change, i.e. settlers, slavery, killing of Native Americans) in terms of war crimes.

Endless hypocrisy, indeed.

Taisho, how would you suggest us Americans become educated on politics? I agree with you that many Americans are blatantly ignorant on politics, myself included. Honestly, I've never had a large amount of interest in politics, which is why I haven't gone out of my way to learn more about them, and I'm still a high school student. Despite my very limited knowledge in this area, I do believe I know more than most Americans on the subject. But do you have a website where an American can go to learn more about economics? Or some kind of online course I can take a look at?

I think many Americans have an idea of how corrupt the government is, but to think it and actually know and believe it are two entirely different things.

I usually don't pay much attention to these kinds of threads, but when myhand, Taisho, and Fatih are all agreeing on a point, I know that side has good support to it. Those three are very intelligent, critical thinking people. While I may not always agree with them, I often learn something from reading what they have written, and it requires me to think more. So to those of you who just assume it is some liberal agenda that is made up, I suggest looking at the evidence and the facts before making a decision.

Edited 3/20/2015 00:10:37

Personal preference here, but avoid using the internet as a firsthand source.

The local public library should offer some good reading material. Books may not be cool or even retro, but seriously, give it a shot. (Not aimed at anyone specifically, just saying.)

A good rule of thumb is to read at least 5 books on any given subject, to become well informed. It's also good to read from different perspectives and sources.

Reading Karl Marx's works such as Das Capital, The Communist Manifesto, et al, without reading Adam Smith's Wealth of Nations and The Invisible Hand will not give you a good insight on the prevailing perception of economics in Europe leading up to WWI. You need to consider all sides and take great care in forming your own opinions based on facts.

Not understanding what was going on in Europe in the 19th century, when it was clearly the military hub of the world at the time, will complicate your ability to connect what was going on in the Far East, the Orient and the America's. The world was already a great deal smaller back then, than we tend to think.

Read, analyze, discuss, repeat.

Edited 3/20/2015 00:24:40

America was totally militaristic in the beginning.

We invaded north Africa in 1805 so that should have sent a message of where we were going

Taisho, not that this is news to you, but the issue is the culture.

In many areas of the US, you will get a negative reaction to being critical against the US unless you are of course negative about a certain political figure (rather than an inherent issue in the system). So usually all the negative energy is often misguided as the big issues seem to transcend political parties or simply is the policy of both parties. For example my thread the other day about Monsanto, which both parties seemingly support.

JSA could chime in and could confirm or deny this, but I think he is a prime candidate as someone who has experienced this, based off of his geographic location. To speak for myself, I grew up in a small town in the North (which is often "left"* leaning, *although most people on the "left" in the US are hardly left anyway) and I experienced this. My opinions were kept to myself at this time and sort of bottled up, because there was nobody to talk to about this. I also studied at university in the south and met many college educated people from all over that region who were also apprehensive about talking about issues inherent in the system.

The icing on the cake was when I lived in Washington DC for one year between university and my current position. Even all my friends, who worked for the government, contractors, or otherwise, still were apprehensive about talking about issues in the system. What interested them was "the game" and how they could get the person they were working for supported or reelected.

While I was in university and in Washington DC I certainly did find anomalies, people who also agreed with me AND were willing to talk about these issues. However, in my experience the numbers of people who truly understand the situation AND are willing to talk about these issues (or are interested in doing so), is quite contrasted by the sheer numbers of those who simply do not care.

How do we fix this? I couldn't say myself. My best solution from a personal viewpoint was just to leave and travel around the world until I find another location that might be a bit more informed. However, in JSA's case, a high school student in Missouri? I suppose his best bet is do some research on his own, he may not other people who are willing to question what is wrong with the states.

In many areas of the US, you will get a negative reaction to being critical against the US
I also studied at university in the south and met many college educated people from all over that region who were also apprehensive about talking about issues inherent in the system.

I find this odd. Maybe it's different in the areas you've been, but when I talk to people I know about politics I hear almost nothing but about how broken the system is, how congress is totally useless, our votes don't seem to count,etc. I have family and friends from multiple parts of Missouri and Iowa that almost all feel disillusioned with the current system.

However, in JSA's case, a high school student in Missouri? I suppose his best bet is do some research on his own, he may not other people who are willing to question what is wrong with the states.

Adding to what I said above, as a person from Missouri I can assure that there is no shortage of complaints (of every kind imaginable) against the government here.