yes @nnn.
Most of players say the want a 3v3 ladder =)

New ladders, such as 3v3, are certainly possible but I want this poll to focus on changes to the existing ones. Honestly, the biggest reason 3v3 ladder hasn't happened yet is because I'm not an experienced 3v3 player so I'm not really qualified to make it. I keep hoping someone will make a CLOT one to iron out all the kinks. If I had more time I'd make a CLOT one myself and try to hand it off to someone.

Make a CLOT Gnuff :D

BS.

PS already tried the CLOT.
He run it for 3 mothns. IT worked.
Time for Fizzer to make the 3v3 EU ladder

Edited 8/28/2014 14:58:52

+1

One question, for the rating issue:
Could we use the same ELO system as chess?

It's only a suggestion, I don't know how trueSkill goes and if that it's better or not :P But i'm fmailair with chess and the rating system, being not perfect, is better than the one we use here (In my opinion).

check previous post, i already explained trueskill is better. ;)

The only reasons I read were that TrueSkill is better because is dynamic and not static, and I agree with that, but the chess ELO is static too.

The bayesElo is common call ELO raing. Is the rating system we use in 1v1 2v2 and seasonal ladder ATM.
Is dynamic, each time one of player you played before change rating, influence your rating as well.
Is based in 2 thing: win rate and average rating of opponent you played.
In trueskillmeant (that we use in realtime ladder) is static (count only the true skill meant at the moment you played your opponent).
Is based by 2 thing: true skill meant that measure your skill, and varation, that you need to have <145 for get a rank. The forumla is TrueSkill - 3*Varation.

I can safety say, the second is much better.

I'm not speaking of the same elo system. I'm speaking of the Elo system used in chess that is static and not dynamic.
In chess your ranking is modified each game taking into account the elo diference and the result (win, lose or draw). When the game is finished and the Elo modified that result doesn't afect you anymore.

I agree that TrueSkill is better than the elo we use now, I only asked if chess elo could be another option.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system
http://remi.coulom.free.fr/Bayesian-Elo/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TrueSkill


Note: Trueskill is a modified version of the EloRatingSystem, it was developed by microsoft to be used for their XBox games. It will proably be simmilar to the EloRatingSystem. However I think certain factors in the EloRatingSystem is better for warlight. specifically the k factor. The k factor controls how much your rating can change based on how high your rating is (and time, but that's not relevant for wl), the higher your rating, the less it will change. I think that would be great for waright.

if you look at realtime ladder rating, you can see it worked better in this 6 months.
The noexpire thing was the key for prevent stall. Also it incentive to play more games.

The noexpire thing was the key for prevent stall

It's hard to stall with 5 min autoboot...

you misunderstand me.
I meant to say, that you could try to make a good run of win in row and w8 for the other loss expire. Then start to play again.
The no expire and the fact you have to play at least one game every 3 days prevent someone jump 1st without deserve it.

But multiday ladder can't work like RT ladder - you can't force people to finish one game every 3 days with 3 day boot. And if you just change rating system to TS, it won't solve stalling problem. We don't know(at least i don't know)how fast games are 'faded out'.

Imagine this:
Player A starts with 5 games at once. He wins 10 games but ultimately he stalls 4 of 5 to prevent breaking winning streak. He wins 15 in a row, then he surrender all 5 games.
Then he tries another run - he wins 25 in a row (with stalling), so his history looks this way:
15 wins followed by 5 loses followed by 25 wins.
The question is - how big is influence of those 5 loses.
If it's marginal - you can still stall to get good ladder result.
If it's big enough and after 25 games your old loses are still affecting your rating - read piggy's post. You may imagine a lot of players with alt accounts trying to get as good result as they can with fresh start, then slowing game pace to the lowest possible.

As a anti-stalling mechanism i would propose one more my idea:
allow to commit only your longest awaiting ladder games - you can't stall with such restriction
(maybe with exception for one/two games to reduce inconvenience - so you can commit game only if no more than one/two others game has longer awaiting time).

@kryzhu.
Look at realtime ladder now.
You have to finish at least 50 games for be competetive, otherwise the variaton is go high you will never go to top of ladder.
After 50 games, one more loss will make you lose 10/15 points. No point for stalling. Also stall in such system is useless. In the opposite, more games you finish, more harder will be increase your rating (or decrease ofc).
If you win 15 games you will have 145 as variation more or less.
let's say you do very good and you have 2500 trueskill meant (that is A LOT).
2500 - 3*145 =2070. Never enough for take top.
So problem solved.

So, if i won 15 next games against you you would still be higer rated than me. I don't think this is what we expect from ladder ranking, as ut should represent contemporary results.

Why has nobody addressed Hennns suggestion? I think it's an excellent idea. A static rating system based on initial rating of players going in. It's fair in Chess and it can be fair here. A suggestion based on this system would be to have a looser matching system - with constant ELO rating, after a couple of months, we have a true ladder. Something like the RT ladder.

@Krzychu. NO. We expect a FAIR ladder. Gnuff's idea makes sense. His system would give the Trueskill result of all players, ranking them accordingly. I still prefer a dual system or true ELO though.

Edited 8/29/2014 11:33:33

Till you get variation < 80, you have no chance to be in top of ladder.
This prevent run of 15 games. At same time prevent stall as well. Bc you if you surr you will not lose much points.
Look at his balls in realtime ladder. HE was 1400, now he is 1900. Past lost count A LOT less than new wins.
Considering no expire, after some months (2,3?) we will all have variation low (under 80) , nobody gain nothnig to stall, nobody can make run and jump 1st. Only skill will help you to do well.
No way to cheat, also bc system pick opponent for you (ofc in a range of 20/30% of your true skill meant).

It will be much more interesting. When a new Number 1 emerges, it will be a notable event and not the result of some run.

yeah for this i want that the same rating system from realtime ladder will be copy for each ladders. Adding for the matchup 30% (or 20%) of your trueskill (not rating!!!).