About diplomacy games, I think of course that Warlight should improve this area. Many players dislike diplomacy games but I think that most of them actually are quite unfamiliar with this kind of playing which is complex. People saying it is just based on luck and those are not competitive games are quite ignorant of what a real diplomacy game truly is, according to me if you are a real roleplayer, you would need a real devotion on it, making an alliance with the right person, decide the right moment when you have to declare war on someone, negociate a peace treaty or negociate for some lands + basic playing and strategy skills. I think those players disregarding diplomacy games, rely it on bad experiences, and some bad diplomacy games which unfortunately are legion because it takes time to fully understand warlight's settings, and the best diplo/roleplaying games are lenghty works...

Here are some reasons of bad diplomacy games according to my own experience:
- the host does not do his job (manage and ensure his custom rules are respected),
- players not respecting game's rules, trolling, etc, this is the worst thing for a diplomacy game,
- bad scenarios and templates: here many factors, wrong map not made for diplomacy games, incomplete custom scenarios, unbalanced income, not reliable story based on wrong historical sources, scenario not respecting a fictional universe...
- players not motivated or enough devoted on roleplaying, diplo games are not for people never participating or never communicating, this is not an 1vs1 game, this is more complex than that.

Warlight already allows us to create any scenario possible, and customize it in an infinite way so really thanks for that.
However, I think some improvements could be implemented, here are some suggestions which could not be that difficult to set up (you are also free to add your own suggestions later):
- During roleplaying games, which are mostly retracing historical events or fictional worlds, it would be great to allow us to assign each players the character/role/title wanted and show during the game their title/role's name (not clear for you I guess, so I will make one example: you play on the Middle Earth map, and you are playing as 'Sauron' during this game when you are looking at the player's name you would see 'Angry Panda – Lord Sauron' or 'Angry Panda – King Louis of France).This I am sure it would make things easier and people could identify themselves easily to their roles.
- If possible, more complex settings allowing us to set up a real diplomacy game, making custom rules impossible to break (example someone becomes PE, 'Public Ennemy' something comparable to an outlaw for the diplo noobs, the Host or players (through an ingame vote) could have some options such as allowing them an 'anti-PE' special booting, removing disturbing players and stop them to ruin a game.
- Advertise better diplomacy games, some possibilites: show players's favorite template and be able to vote for it as it already exists for maps, then people could rely on a ranking system, also implement a ranking system for players (this is perhaps not possible, but I think that ranking could be based on some factors such as player's reputation) or some awards (the best backstabber, the peacemaker, the worst warmonger)


I had many things to say as you see and, if you had the motivation to read all this until the end thanks for your attention :)

Edited 4/11/2015 12:31:20

I imagined that being read in a French accent........ ..............

(off-topic Tupac lol but if you wanna listen a French guy speaking in English hear this : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQcOo8vR-s4, I warn you this is not for kids!)

Edited 4/11/2015 12:48:13

https://www.warlight.net/Forum/84807-diplomacy-games-big-problem?Offset=80 -- HankyPinky wrote:

But what if diplo games had their own tab under multiplayer? Or would that be unnecessary? What do you all [..] think?

Bad idea if you ask me. Let's ignore the problem explained by Angry Panda in https://www.warlight.net/Forum/84807-diplomacy-games-big-problem?Offset=87 and pretend all games are clearly either Diplomacy or "all-out war" (sorry, don't know a better name for "non-diplo"). What would happen if somebody invents a third kind of game? In which category would that go? I don't think asking Fizzer to code a new category just for your experimental new game type (which might turn out to be no fun at all and has to be removed again a few weeks later) is a workable approach.

As it is, Warlight has a perfectly good system for finding games you like: you can see all the settings of a game before you join it (and you can even ask WL to highlight just those settings you find the most important) and the creator of the game can describe any non-gameplay-rules in the description ("Message from host"). This allows for the creation of any kind of game. Using a tag in the name of the game (so, instead of "RvW's Game", I'd call it "RvW's Diplo Game" or "[Diplo] RvW's Game" or something like that) it really should be fairly easy to find games you like (or, really do not like).

And even if we have a new player who has no idea what a "Diplo" is, joins one and after half a turn decides they hate it, they can still surrender and know, from that point on, to skip games like that. If they surrender with a simple "Okay, now I know what Diplo is... not my thing. Sorry for leaving so soon, have fun people!", I'm sure no reasonable players would blacklist them (if somebody still does... let's stay polite: maybe that's for the better for everybody involved).

---

Just about all issues mentioned in this thread are caused by people, when discovering they don't like diplo, feeling the need to express that by yelling and cursing in game chat, deliberately sabotaging the game (why not, to them it was no fun to begin with, right, so no big loss...) or other stupidity like that.

Long story short: WL can't (forcibly) teach manners. The issue is not WL, it's people who think the world revolves around them and each and every single one of their opinions is universal, gospel truth for everybody. Nothing WL does can solve that... :(

Problems about Diplomacy:

1. They take too long.
2. Too many people surrender or get booted.
3. There are too many accidental PEs.
4. There are too many on-purpose PEs.
5. There are too many blacklists.
6. There are too many bad templates.
7. It is too easy for the USA, Russia, China, or India to win.
8. The game is too likely to be ended by vote.
9. There are too many games where the host is booted.
10. There are too many impatient people who get blacklisted for booting.
11. There are too many debates.
12. There are too many problems about Diplomacy.

That's 12 problems about diplomacy!!! So that's why I want them gone. Sorry if everyone thinks I'm a troll but they are certainly not ending on their own so I need to fix them myself. It is not because I am bad at them or am playing too many bad games. If Fizzer won't fix this, I will. Oh yeah, and did you notice that ZERO problems say that I don't like them?

Problems with JS0223:

1. He's impatient
2. He boots all the active players
3. He gets angry when he "accidentally" breaks the rules
4. He gets angry when he "on-purpose" breaks the rules
5. He's not on enough blacklists
6. He thinks that ALL diplomacy templates are bad
7. He doesn't understand that winning is not what makes a good game of diplomacy
8. He doesn't get that the fun game of diplo in itself is the end
9. There are not enough games where he is booted
10. He is one of the impatient people who get blacklisted for booting
11. He doesn't understand how to debate
12. He doesn't get that he is the problem.

That's 12 problems about JS0223!!! So that's why I want him gone. Sorry if everyone thinks he's a troll but he's certainly not quitting on his own so I need to fix him myself. It is not because he is bad at them or he is playing too many bad games. If Fizzer won't fix this, I will. Oh yeah, and did you notice that ZERO of the diplo player in the game care about anything JS0223 says?

lol trollin' the troll...

Darth grover:

brilliant name, brilliant ideas.

Hello. Today, I would like to explain to you why sandwiches should be banned. Recently, I've been eating sandwiches, and I keep choking on them whenever I try to eat them without chewing. A lot of people do this, and since the majority of the world don't eat sandwiches, they should be banned everywhere for the safety of us all. Also, I went to a cooking place and they banned me from going there every again because I made a sandwich wrong, even though I'm perfectly good at all the other foods. Here are 12 reasons why sandwiches should be banned.

1. Choking Hazard
2. If it has peanut butter, and someone is allergic to peanut butter, they could die from eating it.
3. Tastes bad.
4. Takes too much time to make.
5. It falls on the floor too often.
6. There are too many accidentally bad sandwiches.
7. There are too many purposely bad sandwiches.
8. Peanut Butter, Meat, Lettuce, and Jelly sandwiches are too much more popular than the rest.
9. Its too often when you accidentally hurt yourself making one.
10. There are too many impatient people who mix up the layers of the sandwich.
11. There are too many conversations going on while the sandwiches are being made and eaten.
12. There are too many problems about sandwiches.

That's 12 problems about sandwiches!!! So that's why I want them gone. Sorry if everyone thinks I'm a troll but they are certainly not ending on their own so I need to fix them myself. It is not because I am bad at them or am making too many sandwiches. If the master Chef won't fix this, I will. Oh yeah, and did you notice that ZERO problems say that I don't like them?

I concur: sandwiches have done nothing but endanger lives, Think Of The Children! We should outlaw them; capital punishment or otherwise for those homosexuals who are immoral enough to disagree. And don't sew their heads back on either, that's too respectful for them.

Edited 4/12/2015 06:16:54

+1 that

Darth Grover +1

JS0223 ruined again a new game yesterday, the ww2 Semicedevine map, he was in my team (axis) chose the best slot (Germany), taking 10min to commit each turns, not sending armies, and as I expected we lost because of him.

Try this solutions:

1. Play multi-day diplomacies
2. Play only with people you trust.
3. Give them a chance to give back those lands.
4. Blacklist them, and kill him so your country gets stronger.
5. Better than keep playing with them.
6. Create your own one, or tell someone to create it for you as you haven't level enough.
7. Play in Europe maps, they are really fair if you divide Russia.
8. That's the purpose of a diplo, if you want easy points play lotteries.
9. See #2.
10. See #2.
11. That's one of the best things in Diplos, you can challenge someone to a wording war.
12. And you seem to be one of them.

If this solutions doesn't work for you, try @Darth_Grover or @iamtaller solutions. Have a nice day :D

iamtaller,

Your logic is unshakable. It's almost like you learned your argumentive skills from that great debater of legend and lore: JS0223!

Chewing is annoying and for boring people! You're unbreakable reasoning has convinced me to follow your banner!

Let's start a clan called Sandwich Exterminators Brigade.

#banthesammich

Edited 4/12/2015 17:53:15

^^^

xD

https://www.warlight.net/Forum/84807-diplomacy-games-big-problem?Offset=91

12. There are too many problems about Diplomacy.

So actually there's only eleven problems we need to fix then; that'll make problem twelve disappear automatically.

Now, we could try finding one solution per problem, but I prefer killing eleven birds with a single stone if possible. So, here comes my solution to all of your problems (yes, I really do think it will fix much more than your problems with Diplomacy Games):
*drumroll*
*dramatic silence*
Don't play them

Now, if there was a huge flood of games labelled "Not a Diplo, no really, it's not!!!111", but then when you read the rules it is a Diplo, I might figure out a way to see your point, but I've never witnessed that.

So, here's my proposal:
- You don't join Diplo games.
- You let other people decide for themselves whether they play Diplo.

If you have a legitimate concern, where the mere existence of Diplo games negatively impacts those people who don't play them, I'm willing to listen and see if we can think of a better solution. Until that time though, I'm with everybody else on this thread who isn't you and summarise...

TL;DR:
There is no problem.

RvW, I fear that your excellently worded and logical argument will be lost on him...

Just the same, I commend you. :-)

Edited 4/12/2015 20:22:19

Problems with JS0223:

1. He's impatient
2. He boots all the ACTIVE players
3. He gets angry when he "accidentally" breaks the rules
4. He gets angry when he "on-purpose" breaks the rules
5. He's not on enough blacklists
6. He thinks that ALL diplomacy TEMPLATES are bad
7. He doesn't understand that winning is not what makes a good game of diplomacy
8. He doesn't get that the fun game of diplo in itself is the end
9. There are not enough GAMES where he is booted
10. He is one of the impatient people who get blacklisted for booting
11. He doesn't understand how to debate
12. He doesn't get that he is the problem.

That's 12 problems about JS0223!!! So that's why I want him gone. SORRY if everyone thinks he's a troll but he's certainly not quitting on his own so I need to fix him myself. It is not because he is bad at them or he is playing too many bad games. If Fizzer won't fix this, I will. Oh yeah, and did you notice that ZERO of the diplo player in the game care about anything JS0223 says?

1. I don't really think any people are that patient. Besides, when I boot active players it's because like you said, I'm impatient, and because they spend too much time arguing and not enough time taking turns. Also, some people boot me when I'm active but I don't blacklist them!
2. See #1.
3. I always do it on purpose and I don't get angry.
4. See #3.
5. I am on a lot of blacklists, and I don't get how someone can be or not be on enough blacklists.
6. Yeah, because diplomacys are bad themselves.
7. Of course it's not, because nothing makes a good diplomacy game. They are bad, period.
8. Diplomacy games are not fun at all.
9. Again, I don't get how someone can be booted enough or not enough. Also see #1.
10. See #1.
11. I do, and I'm debating right now.
12. I might be, but I'm only being a problem so I can end a problem.

Hello. Today, I would like to explain to you why sandwiches should be banned. Recently, I've been eating sandwiches, and I keep choking on them whenever I try to eat them without chewing. A lot of people do this, and since the majority of the world don't eat sandwiches, they should be banned everywhere for the safety of us all. Also, I went to a cooking place and they banned me from going there every AGAIN because I made a sandwich wrong, even though I'm perfectly good at all the other foods. Here are 12 reasons why sandwiches should be banned.

1. Choking Hazard
2. If it has peanut butter, and someone is allergic to peanut butter, they could die from eating it.
3. Tastes bad.
4. Takes too much time to make.
5. It falls on the floor too often.
6. There are too many accidentally bad sandwiches.
7. There are too many purposely bad sandwiches.
8. Peanut Butter, Meat, Lettuce, and Jelly sandwiches are too much more popular than the rest.
9. Its too often when you accidentally hurt yourself making one.
10. There are too many impatient people who mix up the layers of the sandwich.
11. There are too many CONVERSATIONS going on while the sandwiches are being made and eaten.
12. There are too many problems about sandwiches.

That's 12 problems about sandwiches!!! So that's why I want them gone. SORRY if everyone thinks I'm a troll but they are certainly not ending on their own so I need to fix them myself. It is not because I am bad at them or am making too many sandwiches. If the master Chef won't fix this, I will. Oh yeah, and did you notice that ZERO problems say that I don't like them?

I don't know if he actually meant that, he was probably just copying me. Also, this forum has nothing to do with that and I recommend that he starts a new forum instead of changing the subject of this one.