Fizzer may or may not make a mistake, but do u mind to provide a solution of
1. solving the problem related to u
2. preventing the possibility of actually gaming the seasonal ladder?

1. Go back into the system and put my games back the way they were. I did not surrender. I won all those games on picks. I was on vacation.
2. I already sent Fizzer an email. I made suggestions about things he coukd do to make all ladders better, fairer, more competetive. I also suggested ways to have a system that avoids people from gaming the seasonal ladder. Vacations amd tiebreakers need to be reconsidered. I believe I had my games won on picks and deserved to win. And I legitimately needed a vacation. Others use the vacation and bad tiebreaker to manipulate the system when they have only a 50-50 chance of winning. That is worse. I used the system to ensure I win games I had won on picks. I protected my victories.

Edited 3/14/2014 16:30:16

Don't join games/ladders when you know you won't have the necessary time to complete them. Simple solution.

I had enough time. TWM. Force join. Zibik and Noob. Force join. 4 to 6 days to get to turn 1. When I realized I didn't have time to play, I quit the ladder. But because 3 of my remaining 4 opponents slow played, I ran out of time to play those games.

I didnt have time to finish the games before the season ends. My work w8ll keep me busy until early April at least.

So I knew I couldnt finish the games for the season.

What were my choices?

1. Surrender? But I won on picks.
2. Make as many turns as possible before I go on vacation as if I will be able to finish the games, and hope my attack/defense luck is better than theirs? That gives me a 50-50 chance of winning. I thought my odds were 100%, 100%, 70%+, 70%+. Given the history, my odds were better than what I estimated. Why should I hope for good luck on coin flips when I knew I won on picks?
3. Do what I did. I won on picks, I deserved the wins. They lost on picks. They deserved a loss more than they deserved a win.

Edited 3/14/2014 15:15:58

I think the reason you were punished is because of what you did in first turn, in some of the games: you just deployed, knowing the formula in case of tiebreaker will give you win. Won on picks or not, someone doing this is not going to win because of his superior position, but because of stalling the games like that.

EDIT: Somehow failed to make that sound neutral. I tried just to explain the reason.

Edited 3/14/2014 15:10:43

Fair enough. I respect your opinion. What would you have done in my situation, Widz? You think you have won on picks in four games (including 3 of the top 5 players, who you truly believe you will beat). You know you will be too busy with work and/or life and legitimately require a vacation within a few days. You know you will not be able to finish the season. But you haven't lost a game yet and think you deserve a top ranking based on the quality of your play relative others. Would you...

1. Surrender?
2. Play as many turns as possible before your vacation begins and hope the system gives you the win when the season ends and you are on vacation?
3. Do what I did?

Edited 3/14/2014 15:31:42

I don't know what I would do. I really don't know. I rarely know for sure I won on picks.

In my opinion current settings of the seasonal ladder are not prepared / suitable for situation like this, when you have no time to make a moves, and games are force ended at some point, after just few turns.

EDIT: I think 2 most probably. But maybe because I was never in such situation.

Anyway, one last thing: I don't like what have happened here at all.

I don't like your decision, and I don't like the fact that Fizzer made you surrender. But I can't think of any solution I like.

Edited 3/14/2014 16:10:08

voodoo, if fizzer found it hard to restore the games, any other suggestions?

1. If Fizzer cant restore the games, I would like an apology. I had those games won on picks. Fizzer decided I should lose because of (a) who I am or (b) what he thought was happening or (c) incomplete information about what was happening. What happened: Krzychu posts on a thread, "Voodoo will win because he took one turn in his games and went on vacation." One hour later Fizzer forces me to surrender. Krzychu's assessment was not the full reality of the situation. Fizzer should not act on hunches.

2. Still procede to improve the ladders. Fizzer should not be in the business of picking winners and losers. The system shoukd do that. The system should not be so easy to manipulate. But if it is, he should be fair. If people can postpone surrendering in games on the 1v1 amd 2v2 ladders so they can get a higher rating and ranking, why cant I get wins in games I had won on picks?

3. Legitimate vacations should not be abused or violated by Fizzer. You doubt I had a legitimate vacation? Contact me. I can give you links to my work's website. It clearly states our work schedule. You dont trust that? I can give you my manager's email or even phone number. You want more evidence? I can send you all the paperwork I have written and checked and read over the last couple weeks. By the time Fizzer could read it all, the season would have ended. I have been crazy busy.

Edited 3/14/2014 16:08:47

I thought it was some kind of stings of remorse, that make you surrender in less than an hour after i described your strategy in other topic. Apparently it was just Fizzer^^

Edited 3/14/2014 16:20:25

is "sorry" an apology?

is a private apology acceptable for u?
if yes, would u keep it as secret?

yes i am finding a way out for fizzer

Edited 3/14/2014 16:29:50

Yeah I have to agree with the Fizz on this one. You're on vacation, you know the algorithm in order to win a 'tiebreaker' So you deploy your armies and don't move because you know your opponents will move and thus you will win all 4 of the games without having to actually play them at all. I'm sure if you made a move like you were expanding that Fizzer wouldn't have dropped your games, but you clearly didn't. You made a move like you weren't going to play the game at all. I disagree with that entirely. You can lose any game. Who's to say you wouldn't have bad luck, make a play that your opponent avoids/counter, or make any mistakes? Are you so perfect you can make no mistakes in a win-by-pick scenario?

The best solution was obvious, play your first turn like you intended to win instead of just deploying and going on vacation. It was a total middle finger to your opponents and to the integrity of the seasonal ladder.

I think Fizzer should probably have warned him, but otherwise I completely agree with Lolowut.

I dont need or expect a public apology. I wrote an email to him the moment I noticed what happened. I gave him a day to reply. He didn't. So I made this thread to have a public discussion.

It is worth discussing. I had never before seen Fizzer influence who wins a tournament or get 1st on a ladder. This is uncharted territory.

And he did it without realizing (a) I had my games won on picks and (b) I legitimately need to use vacations until early April.

From a completely neutral point of view, I think voodoo is in the right here actually. Although gaming the system and stalling should be discouraged, it isn't against the rules. From what I read, It seems that fizzed actually abused his admin powers and booted him. The problem is that, there are other people that game the system like this, but the people that suffer from these people don't get their games won like this too, so what fizzer did meant it gave himelf an unfair advantage in the ladders.

This is of course, if fizzer actually did abuse his powers or it was some sort of bug or glitch.

Edited 3/14/2014 16:46:52

Lolowut, I was not going to be able to finish the games. Your option (deploy full and make one move) is essentially the same as what I did. You say I gave a middle finger to the ladder. Your option is to give a middle finger to the ladder under the table. Same strategty, probably the same effect. The only difference: Your strategy tries to make it seem better. It is the same thing. I am not going to hide what I am doing. Let the world see it.

My picks and locations were so good that I deserved to win on a tiebreaker (after 1-3 turns) more than I deserved to lose on a coin flip (after 3-5 turns). I am not able to play 12 games at the moment.

Fizzer advised me to "be sure to use the reinforcement card." What if I played to turn 5 in games I had worse picks and worse positioning; then, I played the reinforcement card, conserved my armies, and went on my vacation? When the season ends, I win because the enemy didn't play his card. Is playing 5-6 turns and winning in a game I should lose better than what I ried to do? Winning on picks and losing by Fizzer is certainly not the best result.

My position is: tiebreakers should determine who deserves to win. My picks are superior to theirs. Would they deserve to win on turn 5 or 6 because their attack luck is better than mine? Either way, I needed a vacation to focus on work and family.

Anyway, back to being busy. Maybe I will be able to respond during bathroom breaks or while walking from one place to another.

Edited 3/14/2014 17:16:59

No I said expand like you were going to play. Not make 1 move.

Ok. Sorry. I misread your ideas.

So if your chances of winning based on picks is 70-100%, you would decide to expand with at least two armies and then take your vacation? You think it is fairer that a coin flip determines the winner after you clearly won the picking stage on a template that is so heavily dependent on picking?

You are a kind person. I am not so kind. I think effort should be rewarded. I worked on making those picks. I earned my advantages. Picks determine more games on that template than play. And when two players are nearly equally matched in skill, picks usually determine the outcome. Trust me, I would have won all four of my games if I didnt need a vacation.

Letting attack luck determine the outcome means I should not have made any attempt at trying to win the picking stage. Instead of making good picks, I could have simply made one pick, be happy with what I got, expand a little, take my vacation, cross my fingers that I win.

Edited 3/14/2014 17:11:39

What effort? You could've just as easily lost the game as you thought you won them on picks. I don't care what you think your percentages of winning were, and I don't care if you feel like a coinflip victory would've been unfair to you. You just should've tried to win the game without trying to take some cheap victory with the algorithm. Who knows, maybe you'd have some time cleared during the last day of the season and could've played some of them realtime. TWM and Bastard usually play realtime if you catch them. The problem is apparent probability doesn't matter. What if your mythical 30% chance to lose happened? Are you saying that your opponent doesn't deserve to even play the game out for their apparent 30% chance of winning? Because that's what you did. You took away ANY chances for them to win by abusing an algorithm. All that because you THOUGHT you had a 70-100% chance of victory. I think that's stuck-up bullshit. Just play the damn game. It's a game that you're apparently taking your wins on way too seriously.

And yes, I am kind. When my opponents get booted in 2v2 ladder, I like to make replacement games to determine the real outcome almost everytime, regardless of whether future opponents will do the same with me. It's because I enjoy PLAYING the game. Winning is fun, but if I earn a victory without actually seeing things to the very end I don't feel as joyed as when I earn a victory from start to finish. So if your perspective of the game is that winning is the only fun point, then sure. Game the system. Use your knowledge of the algorithms to secure yourself your 100% win. It's all petty in the end. However, I don't want to hear you complaining when the creator of the site catches you with your pants down and stops your wins before they drastically affect everyone else.

You were gaming the system. That much is obvious. Fizzer had no right to assume who will win a game, but neither do you. You do not *deserve* to win. You either win or you lose. You stalled the games, you didn't play. It seems pretty cut and dry to me.

You have no right to arrogantly assume you would of won, so playing the match isn't even important.

A better solution: reveal your picks, see if your opponent agrees. They shouldn't be punished for your busy schedule.

And yes, I am kind.

Definition of kind...
Showing sympathy or understanding;

Are you kind, lolo? I think not. Sportsman-like, maybe.

--

I'm surprised at the hate voodoo is getting. Like I said above, stalling or gaming the system is NOT cheating. However, fizzer booting voodoo while he's on vacation gave fizzer an unfair advantage, which IS cheating. Although I'm extremely grateful to fizzer about the time he's spent on this game, I'm more concerned about the abuse of powers rather than unsportsmanlike behavior.

Edited 3/14/2014 17:25:22

I don't think he's abusing his powers, it was a clear case of abusing the mechanic. I am sure Fizzer would of done it even if his own game was not involved.. And in fact he did.