You gamed the system to make sure you had a 100% chance to win those games, there's no excuse for that.

Also, it should be well known by now that Fizzer does what he wants. He is benevolent dictator, but still a dictator. Formalised rules for cases such as this would be welcome rather than Fizzer deciding by himself in each individual circumstance.

edit: whoops didn't see Fizzer's post when I submitted

Edited 3/14/2014 19:01:08

1. Cheat? I didnt break any rules.

2. Stalling games? That is what legitimate vacations do. You cant play when on vacation. Though stalling is a pejorative word. I had time. Your ladder broke. I lost time. My opponents stalled to join and make picks and play. I lost time. I lost about two weeks because your ladder stalled and my opponents stalled. Then I got busy and continued the stalling by going on vacation. My work schedule is independent of your ladder. If your ladder didnt malfunction and my opponents didnt stall, I would have had time to play out most or all of my games (see above).

3. If I lost on picks and some guy has no time to play 12 games and he decides to preserve his victory, I would be pissed. Then I would look at the history and think, "Well, I probably would have lost anyway. Who cares."

Note...
When Gui stalls, it is okay because he has real life matters to attend to.

When Gui's opponents stall, they are just stalling because they don't have real lives so can't be otherwise occupied.

Players are expected to make a reasonable effort to finish a game before the season ends. If you try to intentionally win a game by force-finish that you would have otherwise lost, the win will be taken away from you.

That you would have otherwise lost.

I won on picks. So, if I am unable to finish the game and I know it, what am I supposed to do Fizzer?

1. Not commit my orders and hope the system recognizes my great picks? I get booted on day 3.
2. Make one full attack to act like I will be able to take more turns, even though I already know I will need to be on vacation until early April? That is fake. Why act like I will be able to finish?
3. Surrender? But the games were won on picks. They should surrender if they knew what i knew.
4. Do what Lolowut suggests and expand in at least two locations? But my odds of winning are 70-100% based on what I saw behind the fog, wby would I want a 50-50 coinflip?

Based on how I understand the rules, I didnt break any rules.

Get over it. I am over the losses. It is hard to get over the fact that you violated a legitimate vacation and booted me when I didnt break any rules. I tried to play. 3 of 4 players stalled. Your ladder stalled. I asked Zibik to play in realtime. I made an attempt. But if 3 of 4 stall, I might as well treat all four games equally and just take my vacation.

Edited 3/14/2014 19:16:24

For me the message sent by Fizzer is clear - you want to game the system instead of playing game - do it elsewhere.

Btw, such coincidence - you were so busy earlier, but immediately after being 'booted' by Fizzer you can spend half a day complaining here.

You can keep saying you won on picks but that is completely irrelevant.

If Fizzer says you cheated then that means you cheated. He makes the rules.

Krzychu, good ppoint. I worked 7am to 5pm. It is a momentsry lull in my work schedule this Friday night. I ate dinner. I went home. I passed out. I wome up refreshed. I tackled this issue on the forum. I tried to go to bed. But this issue is nagging me. There are valid responses worth addressing. Tomorrow I will be tired. My work will suffer. This is why I took my vacation, to avoid having to think about games. Good detective work though. You stated the obvious: I am here. But you dont know why. Anyway, Fizzer came to provide one post as usual. I responded as usual. So there is nothing more to say.

Ill let ylu say as yku wish. I have another fu day of work ahewd of me tomorrow.

Fizzer's resp9nse is a bit depressing. His ladder can stall, but we cant have a vacation.

Last time I try to play a seasonal. Too many games in too short a period of time. You have to become a ladder addict or have no life to finish the games.

What about game http://warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=5714290 ?

Voodoo actually attempted to play this game, at least from my standpoint. Regardless of which side you choose in this debate, shouldn't he have at least won this game?

Yes, Ace, I gamed the system just as anybody with a lead will do when they know they only have one final turn before the season ends for them. But I did not cheat. Fizzer says I cheated befause he wants to pick who w8ns the season. Imagine, some guy shows up, wins 13 games easily and wins 4 games on picks amd tiebreakers. People would be upset. So sacrifice the one guy for the good of the community. I get it. It is wise. He is protecting his gsme just as I was protecting my advantages in my games.

But it doesnt make his actions right, just as my actions arent ideal.

I would have prefered to play the games. It is hard to do that without time.

Anyways, I am done. Time to be like you, Ace. Maybe Ill pop up every now and again.

Edited 3/14/2014 19:32:05

Hahaha i can't believe this discussion is still going on :D

Voodoo you clearly on several occasions state by your self you manipulated the system in order to win games YOU think you won on picks (I guess Fizzer has this game all wrong why don't we all just pick and then the game ends and the guy who thinks he has better picks win). You cheated man, manipulated to win just because you think you won, you got caught and got punished for it.

This more than anything else should get you to consider your actions in the future not whine because you got caught.

You actions were wrong, your reasoning behind your actions is wrong, you subsequent reactions are wrong, basically everything you did here makes you look like a cheater. So just learn from your mistakes and go on.

Why is this still happening?


GUI, please shut up.


Signed,
The Internet

Hellbender's ego reaches a new high

way to go fizzer :D

I agree on the 3 auto-surr where you only deployed 5 and didn't bother playing, refering to the wiki:

http://wiki.warlight.net/index.php/Seasonal_Ladder

Players are expected to make a reasonable effort to finish a game before the season ends. If you try to intentionally win a game by force-finish that you would have otherwise lost, the win will be taken away from you.

You didn't make any effort to finish the games, so taking those off from you seems valid

but the 4th game http://warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=5714290
you played it regulary until you took your vacation, personally, i think that auto-surr was too much

I gamed the system to preserve my victories

You cannot say when you have won or not, don't think you are some genius guy that never makes mistakes, misreads an opponent or who loses an advantage which he thought he had after picks...

Man, are you serious? You won few games with players with lower ranks and when it comes to games with better players you pushed warlight's possibilities to "fair cheating" to the limits, delayed games as much as it is possible using many vacations and took advantage on specific rules to determining a winner in the end of the season. It's highly unfair to play like that. Even if you thought that you're going to win it is really unfair to play like "I have already won, so I will delay all game and play to be determined as a winner thanks to those funny rules apllied when ending a season and not give my opponents a chance to fight".
I don't have words which can describe how I consider you as a cheater and unfair player. If you don't have time to play warlight simply don't play it and deal with that warlight demands time. I know this and that WL is hard to combine with studying so I play only in ~3 games at this momment. And magically now you have time to write so many posts in this subject when you should be sooo busy. It is your fault that you don't have time and if this is an obstacle to playing a real game in seasonal ladder you should surrender, not mock seasonal ladder force your opponents to losing by this fishy strategy.

Btw, such coincidence - you were so busy earlier, but immediately after being 'booted' by Fizzer you can spend half a day complaining here.

Perfectly stated, can't believe only one person brought this up.
This invalidates all arguments you bring to the table. The season is still ongoing.

but the 4th game http://warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=5714290
you played it regulary until you took your vacation, personally, i think that auto-surr was too much

Yeah I have to agree. That one should've been taken to the tiebreaker imo. What's done is done though.

If I may, it is good that there is some punishment for gaming the system, however everyone should know it is not the bigger issue. 1v1 ladder stalling has been an issue for years now, no punishment was ever implemented there since the boundaries of what is stalling and what is not would be arbitrary. I don't suppose Fizzer is able to monitor all the games in any seasonal ladder, so I'd expect that to happen again.

The bigger issue obviously is that the system can be gamed and when it can be gamed, eventually it will be. True ELO would be a viable solution, but it takes time to implement. I'll repeat some old ideas how to not allow gaming the system:

1v1 ladder, rank players only after 20 chronologically first games played (would not allow swapping losses for new wins)
2v2 ladder same, but with 15 (probably extend expiration in both)

Seasonal ladder is trickier, but the natural rating inflation throughout the season comes to rescue. Just implement a system that'd promote activity during a season, for example if the season has 15 games, make a small cutoff after 10 games and only allow to play 2 at a time then max, people that would want to get additional games due to natural rating inflation. Probably extend season by a week after the cutoff time. Or even easier, do not allow/limit vacation in seasonal ladder, if someone joins a short event like a seasonal ladder, activity should be mandatory. Making an arbitrary formula based on troops and bonuses will always allow for some abuse.

1v1 ladder, rank players only after 20 chronologically first games played (would not allow swapping losses for new wins)

But this allows gaming a different way - if I'm the current #1 and a ladder runner gets me on his 19th/20th game, I may try to drag the game out to keep first as long as possible. Especially if I'm trying to hold #1 for the longest time period.

Also, this will delay people getting on the ladder if others take vacation, even if they're not stalling.